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	<title>Comments on: A footnoted soapbox&#8230;</title>
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	<link>http://www.footnoted.org/blog-notes/a-footnoted-soapbox/</link>
	<description>Michelle Leder's guide to what's hiding in SEC filings</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 21 Nov 2008 20:03:50 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Patrick</title>
		<link>http://www.footnoted.org/blog-notes/a-footnoted-soapbox/#comment-5751</link>
		<dc:creator>Patrick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jul 2008 23:10:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.footnoted.org/?p=1948#comment-5751</guid>
		<description>Michelle,

Thanks for bringing this to light.  You are always on top of everything.

Best, 
Patrick</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Michelle,</p>
<p>Thanks for bringing this to light.  You are always on top of everything.</p>
<p>Best,<br />
Patrick</p>
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		<title>By: Thomas</title>
		<link>http://www.footnoted.org/blog-notes/a-footnoted-soapbox/#comment-5746</link>
		<dc:creator>Thomas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jul 2008 22:29:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.footnoted.org/?p=1948#comment-5746</guid>
		<description>The registration thing will seem over the top until swindlers start using the Microvision book en masse.  Then everyone will throw their hands up in the air and holler, "Where were the authorities?!".  Regulations are by definition onerous until they thwart the worst case scenario.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The registration thing will seem over the top until swindlers start using the Microvision book en masse.  Then everyone will throw their hands up in the air and holler, &#8220;Where were the authorities?!&#8221;.  Regulations are by definition onerous until they thwart the worst case scenario.</p>
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		<title>By: Michelle Leder</title>
		<link>http://www.footnoted.org/blog-notes/a-footnoted-soapbox/#comment-5742</link>
		<dc:creator>Michelle Leder</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jul 2008 17:40:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.footnoted.org/?p=1948#comment-5742</guid>
		<description>Thanks, Thomas, for the comment and I agree with most of what you say up until the registration issue, which seems a bit over-the-top. Then again, maybe it's naiive of me to think that everyone else out there producing financial content online is as open about their intentions and positions as I try to be: if I own something, I disclose that and if I have a short position, I'll state that too. Oh, and I'm a real person with various ways to contact me and a body of work that enables others to assess whether I'm a BS artist or not.

I guess my biggest problem comes with a distinction in the type of content being produced. Everyone knows that you can read online message boards for individual stocks and get all sorts of stock advice -- long, short and everything in between. But when a SeekingAlpha article appears under the headline section of Yahoo and is mixed in with content from the WSJ, NYTimes, and other media outlets, it appears to be more credible than a message board post, especially when someone notes that they're a fund manager. In this particular case, I seriously doubt the guy was a hedge fund manager, but Seeking Alpha allowed him to identify himself that way without doing their homework to make sure he was who he said he was. Remember: on the internet, even my dog can be a hedge fund manager!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks, Thomas, for the comment and I agree with most of what you say up until the registration issue, which seems a bit over-the-top. Then again, maybe it&#8217;s naiive of me to think that everyone else out there producing financial content online is as open about their intentions and positions as I try to be: if I own something, I disclose that and if I have a short position, I&#8217;ll state that too. Oh, and I&#8217;m a real person with various ways to contact me and a body of work that enables others to assess whether I&#8217;m a BS artist or not.</p>
<p>I guess my biggest problem comes with a distinction in the type of content being produced. Everyone knows that you can read online message boards for individual stocks and get all sorts of stock advice &#8212; long, short and everything in between. But when a SeekingAlpha article appears under the headline section of Yahoo and is mixed in with content from the WSJ, NYTimes, and other media outlets, it appears to be more credible than a message board post, especially when someone notes that they&#8217;re a fund manager. In this particular case, I seriously doubt the guy was a hedge fund manager, but Seeking Alpha allowed him to identify himself that way without doing their homework to make sure he was who he said he was. Remember: on the internet, even my dog can be a hedge fund manager!</p>
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		<title>By: Thomas</title>
		<link>http://www.footnoted.org/blog-notes/a-footnoted-soapbox/#comment-5741</link>
		<dc:creator>Thomas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jul 2008 16:44:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.footnoted.org/?p=1948#comment-5741</guid>
		<description>Michelle, thanks for bringing up a really interesting topic.  First, Michael, SeekingAlpha makes plenty of money.  Their syndication deal with Yahoo! Finance alone probably gives them substantial cash flow.  David Jackson relocated it to Israel to get favorable tax treatment on all of the money he makes off of it.  Second, the more interesting thing about Seeking Alpha is that David Jackson gets to make money off of other people's content.  "Prosumer" investors are so desperate to be validated by being "published" by Seeking Alpha that they contribute the majority of the content which is what, in turn, drives viewers and creates the value!  Michelle is right, the only reason why a hedge fund would post to that venue is to affect the value of a stock it already owns.  SeekingAlpha will become ground zero for the "newsletter crowd".  The Microvision scenario is now the playbook:
1. Find a microcap company
2. Put on a large short position
3. Publish a bear thesis on SA under a pseudonym
4. Liquidate the position
The real issue that Michelle brings up is that the information flow around stocks is becoming increasingly influenced by online sources such as SeekingAlpha.  The question is how can they be monitored or regulated so that we prevent unfair influence that hurts individual investors?  Maybe there should be some sort of registration process of online publishers and writers that author content about publicly traded companies.  You can create a materiality threshhold so that people just mentioning companies or stocks within a larger, non-investment related context are excluded from the requirement.  However, to become an investment-oriented blog, you should have to register with the authorities, disclose your positions and provide proof that you are who you say you are.  Anonymity doesn't really provide any benefits as people should be able to stand behind their negative thesis.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Michelle, thanks for bringing up a really interesting topic.  First, Michael, SeekingAlpha makes plenty of money.  Their syndication deal with Yahoo! Finance alone probably gives them substantial cash flow.  David Jackson relocated it to Israel to get favorable tax treatment on all of the money he makes off of it.  Second, the more interesting thing about Seeking Alpha is that David Jackson gets to make money off of other people&#8217;s content.  &#8220;Prosumer&#8221; investors are so desperate to be validated by being &#8220;published&#8221; by Seeking Alpha that they contribute the majority of the content which is what, in turn, drives viewers and creates the value!  Michelle is right, the only reason why a hedge fund would post to that venue is to affect the value of a stock it already owns.  SeekingAlpha will become ground zero for the &#8220;newsletter crowd&#8221;.  The Microvision scenario is now the playbook:<br />
1. Find a microcap company<br />
2. Put on a large short position<br />
3. Publish a bear thesis on SA under a pseudonym<br />
4. Liquidate the position<br />
The real issue that Michelle brings up is that the information flow around stocks is becoming increasingly influenced by online sources such as SeekingAlpha.  The question is how can they be monitored or regulated so that we prevent unfair influence that hurts individual investors?  Maybe there should be some sort of registration process of online publishers and writers that author content about publicly traded companies.  You can create a materiality threshhold so that people just mentioning companies or stocks within a larger, non-investment related context are excluded from the requirement.  However, to become an investment-oriented blog, you should have to register with the authorities, disclose your positions and provide proof that you are who you say you are.  Anonymity doesn&#8217;t really provide any benefits as people should be able to stand behind their negative thesis.</p>
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		<title>By: Michelle Leder</title>
		<link>http://www.footnoted.org/blog-notes/a-footnoted-soapbox/#comment-5729</link>
		<dc:creator>Michelle Leder</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Jun 2008 13:42:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.footnoted.org/?p=1948#comment-5729</guid>
		<description>@ Wax: If you look at the way the stock traded on Monday -- here's a &lt;a href="http://finance.google.com/finance?chdnp=1&#038;chdd=1&#038;chds=1&#038;chdv=1&#038;chvs=maximized&#038;chdeh=0&#038;chdet=1214576040000&#038;chddm=1955&#038;q=NASDAQ:MVIS&#038; rel="nofollow"&gt;link&lt;/a&gt;, you can see that it opened at $3.40 and closed at $3. That's a lot of movement for one day, though a longer view of this stock clearly shows a lot of volatility. 

As for who was behind the post, there's been a few theories in addition to underwater executives. One I read over the weekend suggested it was folks from either the Motley Fool or Street.com -- two competitors in terms of financial content -- who were seeking to make SA look bad.

As to SA's Quality Control, which my friend David Phillips brings up, SA Founder David Jackson says they have 1,300 contributors. There is simply no way to manage that number of contributors without an extensive (and expensive) staff whose job it is to vet pieces before they are posted. Just something to keep in mind the next time you read something on SA. My own experience with SA was that the editing was limited to changing my headline for SEO-purposes to maximize Google ad revenue as opposed to editorial purposes.

Folks from the SEC (and the DOJ) read this site regularly, judging by my logs, so let's hope they can get to the bottom of this.

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ Wax: If you look at the way the stock traded on Monday &#8212; here&#8217;s a <a href="http://finance.google.com/finance?chdnp=1&#038;chdd=1&#038;chds=1&#038;chdv=1&#038;chvs=maximized&#038;chdeh=0&#038;chdet=1214576040000&#038;chddm=1955&#038;q=NASDAQ:MVIS&#038; rel="nofollow">link</a>, you can see that it opened at $3.40 and closed at $3. That&#8217;s a lot of movement for one day, though a longer view of this stock clearly shows a lot of volatility. </p>
<p>As for who was behind the post, there&#8217;s been a few theories in addition to underwater executives. One I read over the weekend suggested it was folks from either the Motley Fool or Street.com &#8212; two competitors in terms of financial content &#8212; who were seeking to make SA look bad.</p>
<p>As to SA&#8217;s Quality Control, which my friend David Phillips brings up, SA Founder David Jackson says they have 1,300 contributors. There is simply no way to manage that number of contributors without an extensive (and expensive) staff whose job it is to vet pieces before they are posted. Just something to keep in mind the next time you read something on SA. My own experience with SA was that the editing was limited to changing my headline for SEO-purposes to maximize Google ad revenue as opposed to editorial purposes.</p>
<p>Folks from the SEC (and the DOJ) read this site regularly, judging by my logs, so let&#8217;s hope they can get to the bottom of this.</p>
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		<title>By: David J Phillips</title>
		<link>http://www.footnoted.org/blog-notes/a-footnoted-soapbox/#comment-5721</link>
		<dc:creator>David J Phillips</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Jun 2008 03:08:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.footnoted.org/?p=1948#comment-5721</guid>
		<description>Michelle:

First, I agree with the comments made by Davis. Although I do not question the integrity of the folks working over at SA, the plethora of "fluff" content being published over at their shop these days hurts the SA Brand. David Jackson faces a difficult issue--how to grow SA traffic. This road taken--the more content published, the more traffic stopping by his site. Sadly, as pointed out by your readers, too few editors trying to follow too many postings. Albeit I left SA on good terms, Davis is correct in pointing out that reputation is everything. I did not want my 10Q Detective brand associated with a site known for neophyte 'would-be' analysts. [that said, many an irrate bull has called me a hack when they disagreed w. my posited opinions!]

Second, the entire SA fiasco reminds me of the stunt 15-year old high-schooler Jonathan Lebed pulled back in 2000, spamming Yahoo! Inc's message boards with hundreds of 'pumped-up' stories, heralding certain penny stocks as buys--as he was selling into the volume expansion &#38; stock price jumps.

In the end, however, is SA any different from buying a stock based on a brokerage-pumped buy recommendation?

As you succinctly said: "buyer beware!"

My Best,
David J Phillips, editor
10Q Detective</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Michelle:</p>
<p>First, I agree with the comments made by Davis. Although I do not question the integrity of the folks working over at SA, the plethora of &#8220;fluff&#8221; content being published over at their shop these days hurts the SA Brand. David Jackson faces a difficult issue&#8211;how to grow SA traffic. This road taken&#8211;the more content published, the more traffic stopping by his site. Sadly, as pointed out by your readers, too few editors trying to follow too many postings. Albeit I left SA on good terms, Davis is correct in pointing out that reputation is everything. I did not want my 10Q Detective brand associated with a site known for neophyte &#8216;would-be&#8217; analysts. [that said, many an irrate bull has called me a hack when they disagreed w. my posited opinions!]</p>
<p>Second, the entire SA fiasco reminds me of the stunt 15-year old high-schooler Jonathan Lebed pulled back in 2000, spamming Yahoo! Inc&#8217;s message boards with hundreds of &#8216;pumped-up&#8217; stories, heralding certain penny stocks as buys&#8211;as he was selling into the volume expansion &amp; stock price jumps.</p>
<p>In the end, however, is SA any different from buying a stock based on a brokerage-pumped buy recommendation?</p>
<p>As you succinctly said: &#8220;buyer beware!&#8221;</p>
<p>My Best,<br />
David J Phillips, editor<br />
10Q Detective</p>
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		<title>By: Frank Graham</title>
		<link>http://www.footnoted.org/blog-notes/a-footnoted-soapbox/#comment-5720</link>
		<dc:creator>Frank Graham</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Jun 2008 02:56:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.footnoted.org/?p=1948#comment-5720</guid>
		<description>Thanks. Quick kill Bandits everywhere.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks. Quick kill Bandits everywhere.</p>
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		<title>By: wax</title>
		<link>http://www.footnoted.org/blog-notes/a-footnoted-soapbox/#comment-5719</link>
		<dc:creator>wax</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Jun 2008 01:33:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.footnoted.org/?p=1948#comment-5719</guid>
		<description>First of all, while I do go the SeekingAlpha site, and I do receive a daily e-mail from them, I am not familiar with this company or the events being discussed. So when I read Michelle's newsletter I was initially intrigued.

The first thing I did was to try and see what type of damage this person's post did to the company's stock price, and it appears, at least to me, it did little damage. Over the past 5 trading sessions, the stock has traded between $2.87 and $3.13, with $3.13 coming on Monday 06.24.08.

The next thing I did was take a look at the company's resistance and support numbers. Based on current levels of $2.87, the stock has first resistance at $3.27, a 14% increase from current levels, $3.47, a 21% increase from current levels, and support at $1.82, a 37% decline from current levels. Looking at these numbers tells me if the mystery person's intent was to make money shorting the stock, he left one helluva lot of money on the table.

Lastly I looked at the company's financials from their last SEC 10-K filing of December 2007. I have to ask. How could a company with financials as poor as this company's, ever manage to end up with 56.7 million shares of stock outstanding? No offense, and I realize we all start somewhere, but I have a real hard time believing that anyone would intentionally buy shares of stock in this company.

Based on my back of the napkin math, the company has Net Operating Profit After Taxes of (251.4%)! In addition, Shareholder Equity is $0.58, the same as Tangible Book Value, and the company had a Return on Invested Capital of (107%). Lastly, the company has an Enterprise Value of $2.64, an Equity Value of $3.10, and a PE of (6.2).

So what does all of this mean? To be honest I have no idea. But it makes me wonder if the company is going to remain a going concern, which further makes me wonder if perhaps an insider attempted to short the stock because they knew the stock options they held were soon going to be worthless. I'm not saying that's what has happened, I'm just saying were I the SEC, I would certainly be looking in that direction.

Wax</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>First of all, while I do go the SeekingAlpha site, and I do receive a daily e-mail from them, I am not familiar with this company or the events being discussed. So when I read Michelle&#8217;s newsletter I was initially intrigued.</p>
<p>The first thing I did was to try and see what type of damage this person&#8217;s post did to the company&#8217;s stock price, and it appears, at least to me, it did little damage. Over the past 5 trading sessions, the stock has traded between $2.87 and $3.13, with $3.13 coming on Monday 06.24.08.</p>
<p>The next thing I did was take a look at the company&#8217;s resistance and support numbers. Based on current levels of $2.87, the stock has first resistance at $3.27, a 14% increase from current levels, $3.47, a 21% increase from current levels, and support at $1.82, a 37% decline from current levels. Looking at these numbers tells me if the mystery person&#8217;s intent was to make money shorting the stock, he left one helluva lot of money on the table.</p>
<p>Lastly I looked at the company&#8217;s financials from their last SEC 10-K filing of December 2007. I have to ask. How could a company with financials as poor as this company&#8217;s, ever manage to end up with 56.7 million shares of stock outstanding? No offense, and I realize we all start somewhere, but I have a real hard time believing that anyone would intentionally buy shares of stock in this company.</p>
<p>Based on my back of the napkin math, the company has Net Operating Profit After Taxes of (251.4%)! In addition, Shareholder Equity is $0.58, the same as Tangible Book Value, and the company had a Return on Invested Capital of (107%). Lastly, the company has an Enterprise Value of $2.64, an Equity Value of $3.10, and a PE of (6.2).</p>
<p>So what does all of this mean? To be honest I have no idea. But it makes me wonder if the company is going to remain a going concern, which further makes me wonder if perhaps an insider attempted to short the stock because they knew the stock options they held were soon going to be worthless. I&#8217;m not saying that&#8217;s what has happened, I&#8217;m just saying were I the SEC, I would certainly be looking in that direction.</p>
<p>Wax</p>
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		<title>By: Davis Freeberg</title>
		<link>http://www.footnoted.org/blog-notes/a-footnoted-soapbox/#comment-5712</link>
		<dc:creator>Davis Freeberg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Jun 2008 21:29:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.footnoted.org/?p=1948#comment-5712</guid>
		<description>@Michael - I somehow doubt that SA is losing money.  They charge companies a boatload of money in order to run the conference call transcripts, but there isn't any way for me to know for sure what they are or aren't making.  If SA didn't want to screen the articles themselves, they could always tap into the community to vet them before they are released to the wider public.  I'm sure that there would be traders or community members who would be happy to do some legwork if it gave them early access to the articles.  Of course this would raise some even more problematic issues, but my point is that an inexpensive solution could be possible.  Ideally, I'd be happy if they just fact checked the non-blogger articles.  If someone is submitting something for the first time, there is no accountability.  If someone has published for a couple of years, then you can go back and see what their posting history looks like.  After even a little bit of deception people will get called to the carpet pretty quick.  This helps to get more people honest.  

While I do agree with you that the internet is transforming media and raising some interesting issues, I also feel that reputation is going to become even more important not less.  Ten years ago, I used to read newspapers, but couldn't tell you who the writer was.  Now with RSS, I pay attention to individual writers, but couldn't tell you which publication(s) they work with.  I think Michelle's site is a great example.  Because she has such a strong track record of uncovering scuzbuckets and (attempted) buried information, I know that when she publishes something that I don't have to fact check her because she has always stuck to the facts in her articles.  When it comes to a random blogger or message board commenter, I always try and verify what's being posted before blogging about it or telling people.  All of this caos may end up distracting the mainstream media, but it also enhances the value of the great journalists.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Michael - I somehow doubt that SA is losing money.  They charge companies a boatload of money in order to run the conference call transcripts, but there isn&#8217;t any way for me to know for sure what they are or aren&#8217;t making.  If SA didn&#8217;t want to screen the articles themselves, they could always tap into the community to vet them before they are released to the wider public.  I&#8217;m sure that there would be traders or community members who would be happy to do some legwork if it gave them early access to the articles.  Of course this would raise some even more problematic issues, but my point is that an inexpensive solution could be possible.  Ideally, I&#8217;d be happy if they just fact checked the non-blogger articles.  If someone is submitting something for the first time, there is no accountability.  If someone has published for a couple of years, then you can go back and see what their posting history looks like.  After even a little bit of deception people will get called to the carpet pretty quick.  This helps to get more people honest.  </p>
<p>While I do agree with you that the internet is transforming media and raising some interesting issues, I also feel that reputation is going to become even more important not less.  Ten years ago, I used to read newspapers, but couldn&#8217;t tell you who the writer was.  Now with RSS, I pay attention to individual writers, but couldn&#8217;t tell you which publication(s) they work with.  I think Michelle&#8217;s site is a great example.  Because she has such a strong track record of uncovering scuzbuckets and (attempted) buried information, I know that when she publishes something that I don&#8217;t have to fact check her because she has always stuck to the facts in her articles.  When it comes to a random blogger or message board commenter, I always try and verify what&#8217;s being posted before blogging about it or telling people.  All of this caos may end up distracting the mainstream media, but it also enhances the value of the great journalists.</p>
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		<title>By: Michael Goode</title>
		<link>http://www.footnoted.org/blog-notes/a-footnoted-soapbox/#comment-5711</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Goode</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Jun 2008 19:57:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.footnoted.org/?p=1948#comment-5711</guid>
		<description>Davis - there is no way that SA could fact check articles. They lose enough money as it is. I agree with the quality argument--there were some of my articles that they posted that I wish they hadn't.

I think what this whole incident is indicative of something much broader that few people understand ... in the next few decades we will likely see the breakdown of copyright law, defamation law, and a further decline of main stream media. People will learn that all that reputation means little and it will become easier to check facts (for example, it took me 40 seconds to check MVIS's balance sheet and cash flow). I could go on an on about how the paid media messes up their facts all the time (and I know y'all would probably agree) ... for example, has 60 Minutes issued a retraction of their Biovail story yet? 

The fact that those who left comments on the blog post quickly pointed out the article's flaws and the fact that the article got pulled shows that the system works. Those who were dumb enough to sell the stock because of a random internet article shouldn't have owned the stock in the first place, because they obviously did not due diligence.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Davis - there is no way that SA could fact check articles. They lose enough money as it is. I agree with the quality argument&#8211;there were some of my articles that they posted that I wish they hadn&#8217;t.</p>
<p>I think what this whole incident is indicative of something much broader that few people understand &#8230; in the next few decades we will likely see the breakdown of copyright law, defamation law, and a further decline of main stream media. People will learn that all that reputation means little and it will become easier to check facts (for example, it took me 40 seconds to check MVIS&#8217;s balance sheet and cash flow). I could go on an on about how the paid media messes up their facts all the time (and I know y&#8217;all would probably agree) &#8230; for example, has 60 Minutes issued a retraction of their Biovail story yet? </p>
<p>The fact that those who left comments on the blog post quickly pointed out the article&#8217;s flaws and the fact that the article got pulled shows that the system works. Those who were dumb enough to sell the stock because of a random internet article shouldn&#8217;t have owned the stock in the first place, because they obviously did not due diligence.</p>
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